Wanna read the most comprehensive explanation

[ARMORMAN]

C'mon now Pride, don't get all AOC hysterical. No way we go 0-fer, and no way we resurrect the berry debacle. I love you like a brother, and I respect your fullback mentality, but that just ain't in the cards.

2 reasons:

1. Jeff Monken. He's maniacal about WINNING and he's built this program from the ground level to do just that. We have outstanding facilities, superb coordinators and position coaches, a great all-year strength program, and a warrior culture that's the envy of every program in America, just to mention a very few of his contributions. All, as I said, with a singular goal: Just win baby. He gets that, and it couldn't be farther from berry's mentality, which was all about self-promotion.

2. Our offensive players. Look at every position group. It's not an exaggeration to say that they are all among or close to the best we've had. We have QB's who are built to take hits, can run and throw, and read the defenses. 2 from the yearling class and 2 more from USMAPS look like great backups to Bryson. Our slots are flat out speed merchants with T-Rob, Marshall, Short. We have power runners too, with Riley and Buchanan. WR's? Uh, yeah, Alston easily the best since Poe and likely better. Tight ends are tall, strong, and good hands people. Maybe the best for last, and you should especially appreciate them: Our O line. Over a dozen now over 300 lbs, and watch "Last of the Hard" on youtube to see them in the weight room. If these guys can't move the pile, then I'll be surprised...


But just to be honest and keep things in perspective, there is 1 thing that I personally regret:

Years ago, we had an offense that was almost unique to us. Except for squids, zooms and GTU for a little while, no one else ran it. So we had a leg up on most teams for that reason. We recruited specific body types and talents, we practiced and perfected that option to a razor's edge, and we literally ran it down everyone's throat. No one could stop it, but no one else wanted it either because it was dull and lacked glamor. It was our little out-in-the-open secret. Army's ground option. And the best part, we didn't have to compensate for not having a similar "secret" defense (which was impossible), because when you run a 12-play 9 minute drive your defense is back on the bench sippin' gatorades. That's what I regret, an offense that was ours alone and built for our mentality and SO incredibly effective when we used all the tools in the kit.

But times change. Athletes change. And most damaging, RULES change. It's Jeff Monken's fixed option that the cut block restrictions prevent us from getting defenders on the ground like we used to, and he made a bold range change. So now we'll run gun-option offense, one that anyone could adopt, should they so desire. So we had better be more precise, more disciplined, more determined, more combative, and more effective.

My money's on Jeff.

[ArmyRoadFan7]

Something touched me deep inside
The day the option died

[PrideandDream]

Lots of preseason optimism. We shall see. Hope I'm wrong.

Deeds not words.

PD

[Brovol1]

C'mon now Pride, don't get all AOC hysterical. No way we go 0-fer, and no way we resurrect the berry debacle. I love you like a brother, and I respect your fullback mentality, but that just ain't in the cards.

2 reasons:

1. Jeff Monken. He's maniacal about WINNING and he's built this program from the ground level to do just that. We have outstanding facilities, superb coordinators and position coaches, a great all-year strength program, and a warrior culture that's the envy of every program in America, just to mention a very few of his contributions. All, as I said, with a singular goal: Just win baby. He gets that, and it couldn't be farther from berry's mentality, which was all about self-promotion.

2. Our offensive players. Look at every position group. It's not an exaggeration to say that they are all among or close to the best we've had. We have QB's who are built to take hits, can run and throw, and read the defenses. 2 from the yearling class and 2 more from USMAPS look like great backups to Bryson. Our slots are flat out speed merchants with T-Rob, Marshall, Short. We have power runners too, with Riley and Buchanan. WR's? Uh, yeah, Alston easily the best since Poe and likely better. Tight ends are tall, strong, and good hands people. Maybe the best for last, and you should especially appreciate them: Our O line. Over a dozen now over 300 lbs, and watch "Last of the Hard" on youtube to see them in the weight room. If these guys can't move the pile, then I'll be surprised...


But just to be honest and keep things in perspective, there is 1 thing that I personally regret:

Years ago, we had an offense that was almost unique to us. Except for squids, zooms and GTU for a little while, no one else ran it. So we had a leg up on most teams for that reason. We recruited specific body types and talents, we practiced and perfected that option to a razor's edge, and we literally ran it down everyone's throat. No one could stop it, but no one else wanted it either because it was dull and lacked glamor. It was our little out-in-the-open secret. Army's ground option. And the best part, we didn't have to compensate for not having a similar "secret" defense (which was impossible), because when you run a 12-play 9 minute drive your defense is back on the bench sippin' gatorades. That's what I regret, an offense that was ours alone and built for our mentality and SO incredibly effective when we used all the tools in the kit.

But times change. Athletes change. And most damaging, RULES change. It's Jeff Monken's fixed option that the cut block restrictions prevent us from getting defenders on the ground like we used to, and he made a bold range change. So now we'll run gun-option offense, one that anyone could adopt, should they so desire. So we had better be more precise, more disciplined, more determined, more combative, and more effective.

My money's on Jeff.

Spot on!

[wpgrad]

5-6 wins in 2023. Will be similar to last year, probably not bowl eligible.

10 wins in 2024 (with albeit an easier schedule).

mark it down, these predictions are rock solid. Highly encourage a large bet if you have a book willing to do so.

[ARMORMAN]

It's kind of bizarre, the way all 3 academies evolved recently...

There was a time not so long ago when we were all cookie-cutter triple option offenses, but not so now. We've all taken different approaches.

The zoomies, for their part, are not moving off the DeBerry/Hatfield prototype. Will still run basically the same under center triple option. Not fazed by cut block restrictions. Will compensate by execution in the O line, find a ball-carrying replacement for Mister Roberts somewhere in the Neighborhood and hope that life goes on.

We are polar opposite. Determined that new cut block rules now prohibit an effective under center option run game, we will run a gun option instead. Hired Thatcher the guru from Neb Kearney where his offense put up ridiculous numbers over 2 seasons. We will now have a front row seat to see if those numbers were more the result of an all-world QB he had as a trigger man, or whether we can adopt it as effectively with our roster. Fingers crossed!

And then there's the squids. They seem to be in the middle. They'll keep the basic playbook, but hired the OC from Kennisaw State to "juice it up" a little and loosen defenses. Presume that means more passing, reverses, jet sweeps, counters, etc. Actually, pretty much what many of us were screaming for Davis to do when he went stupid stale...

So it'll be a fascinating scenario to watch....

One more point:

For those who question whether our guys will have enough time to learn and perfect an entirely new offense, a little story to maybe ease that concern:

WAY back in '66, Paul Dietzel was the Army Head coach. Hired from LSU, where he won a Nat'l Championship. But Paul was dissatisfied with what he considered a lack of support from the Academy Administration for what was needed to win, so he quit. He was probably right, but he quit AFTER spring practice. Too late to hire a replacement. All available were spoken for. So Army promoted their plebe football coach, Tom Cahill (recently inducted into the Army Sports HOF). Tom recruited many players in my class, including Charlie Jarvis, Kenny Johnson, and Gary Steele, so we were comfortable and confident with him.

Here's the point:

Tom did not like Dietzel's offense, so he installed an entirely new one. It was called the "Fan series", and it was not so dissimilar from today's RPO where you ride the fullback and then pull or keep or throw based on the defense. Keep in mind that we had exactly 4 weeks to learn and perfect this offense in August, because spring practice had come and gone.

Bottom line: We went 8 - 2 that year, beat the squids, and got a Sugar Bowl bid.

Cadets are smart. They learn fast, especially when motivated and coached by great men. I think we'll be ready...

[RABBLE]

With all that, Coach Tom won the COACH OF THE YEAR honors that year !!!
WOW! FIRST year head coach and he wins national coach of the year award. Amazing!

[westcoastarmyfan]

The difference between Dietzel's offense and Cahill's was amazing to watch. I guess it didn't hurt to have someone like Steve Lindell as QB

[ARMORMAN]

With Jimmy O'Toole as a back up. All he did was come in and help win the navy game our senior year.....

(Personal note: Steve and Jimmy, both dear friends, are the reasons I would never letter in football at Army. I was a decent QB in HS, lightly recruited, and went to WP to walk on and play for the Black and Gold. But those 2 guys were better than me and in my own class!)

[westcoastarmyfan]

Armorman said: With Jimmy O'Toole as a back up. All he did was come in and help win the navy game our senior year.....

I was in RVN and enjoyed the replay of that game that they showed us over there. Even though we knew the outcome it was fun to watch O'Toole save the day.